karinschoenherr's picture
Short-term irrationalities- Part II

"Hi everybody,

yesterday I had to behave like Mr.Market itself. I felt like a trader because I was forced to sell 2 companies to buy additional shares of HOG and  Nokia (NOK).
In this post I want to share my idea why I thought (and still think) that it would be foolish not to grab Nokia at such a low price.

First: The company

Nokia was founded in 1865 and transformed its business numerous times. It looks like they were in almost every possible business in the last 150 years. They began in the pulp-mill- business. Later they sold rubber boots and TVs. In the 1980s Nokia began in the mobile-phone business.
Nokia consist on 4 units:

Mobile phones: Roundabout 50% of their revenues
Enterprise and Networks: Roundabout 30% of their revenues
Multimedia: Roundabout 20% of their revenues

In the mobile phone market Nokia is the powerhouse with a 40% market share of the global market. Their biggest competitors consist on Motorola, Samsung, LG and Sony-Ericsson.

Is there a moat?

Definetely. Nokia, becuause of its size has an enormous economies of scales-advantage. Their cost per unit is significantly lower than the cost of the competition (Nokia $110, Motorala $140, Samsung $180, LG $160 and Sony-Ericsson $170).

Business outlook:

The business outlook is still intact because the emerging markets offer still a lot of growth opportunities. The purchase decision of the end-user depends mostly on the price alone, where Nokia has the edge against the competition.

The developed markets seems- on first look- saturated because most people have already a mobile phone. It is mostly a replacement market where the purchase decision depends mostly on new features than on price alone.

Developed/lesser developed countries and the sales: (pages 56 ff. of form 20F-2007)

One might could think that most of the selling is in Europe and in Nortamerica. Think twice!!
Only 30% of the business in terms of units is made in Europe and North America (The market share in North America is only 10%). Because of the price differentiation between countries Nokia makes 44% of the revenues in Europe and North America.

The earnings in the mobile phone market growed in the last years mainly not because of the growth in the revenues. It growed because of lower cost structures and higher unit sales(remember: low cost provider!!).

This is a thing that I truly believe Mr. Market is missing!

Implications:

The main business of Nokia is outside the "developed world". Because of their status as price leader I believe the growth opportunities are high for Nokia.

Developed world:

In this field Nokia made a real smart move. They aqcuired Navteq-one of the two primary global electronic mapping companies- for 8.1 billion $ (on first look a catastrophic high price). Navteqs competitor- Tele Atlas- itself will be acquired from Garmin or TomTom (it depends on regulatory issues).

One direct implication in acquiring Navteq is the possibility of gaining additional market share and or higher pricing power in the developed countries (remember: The buying decision in the developed countries depends mainly on features like photoshooting or in the future GPS).

As a byproduct of the acquisition Nokia take a step in the GPSmarket itself and is a dangerous thread to companies like Garmin or TomTom.

Because of the largeness of Nokias business (400 million units mobile phones per year) it is definetely possible that the company offer GPS navigational equipment to the end-user at an unbelievable low additional price, so that the GPS-mobile phone will be an extreme cheap alternative to the GPSsystems of Garmin, TomTom and others.

Valuation:

Until yesterday the valuation was low. Since yesterday the valuation is absurd.
What happened?

Mr.Market got his depression because Nokia expects that the growth (not the absolute numbers) will decline. Reasons are the weak $ (I think everybody with a brain expects that European companies will suffer from the weak $.)
The growth in the first quarter was lower than Mr.Market expected. Nokias revenues growed "only" 28% (yes you read right. 28%!!!!!) But Mr.Market expected 29%. Think what happened? Mr. Market hammered the company 14% down!!

Mr. Market was also surprised that the revenue per unit in @ sank from 83€ to 79€!!
I think nobody explained the funny old man, that there are two things that you can expect:
1. If the $ is weak and you sell in $, so the € numbers decline.
2. Nokia earns the money because of economies of scale.

Right now the valuation is as follows: (I use the numbers of 2007 and expect no growth in 2008)

PE: 10
PR: 1.4
PB: 4.8
ROA: 19%
ROE: 60%
Revenue-margin: 14%

You think 2007 was the exeption from the rule? Better think twice! In the last 14 years Nokia earned always more than 20% on their equity.

Happy investing and much fun with Mr.Market!




I'm definitely with you on

I'm definitely with you on that on Karin and i'm looking to raise my NOK stake. It has never been this cheap in terms of earnings multiple ever. And it has great growth prospects (on low end emerging markets because its the low cost producer and in the high end developed markets with its very complete services offerings like music, games and maps) with a great franchise value. It should always trade at premium to its sector.

Hi Karin,nice take on NOK-

Hi Karin,

nice take on NOK- will have a look at it and give you some feedback.

I haven't thorougly read your comments on JNJ on billyticket's blog but I am wondering why you are invested there. Same for GCI and HOG. I would appreciate any comments on what your investment thesis is on these three stocks. Thanks!

- Jan





Reply to JanHendrik

Hi JanHendrik,

I love the valuation of JNJ. I cant even believe that the price is around 60$ that long.

Moat:

They have a- in my view- really satisfying moat in every of the 3 business they are in.

Valuation:

One word? Laughable. This is a company that earned consistently 29% on its equity in the last 20 years (probably longer, but my numbers include "only" the last 20 years). The PE is very modest, PB-ratio was lower only in 1987 and 1988, and the PB in relation to the ROE is absurd in my view.

The numbers of JNJ are very predictable, because Mr.Market think it is a pharmaplay the valuation is so low.
But the interesting parts of the company are in my view the 2 other business they are in.

For me JNJ is a no-brainer that I will hold probably forever. In my real portfolio JNJ is with USG my biggest position (no dont fear that I sold my Bijou :-) )


Why HOG?

Cash-mashine, wonderful business with a moat (that probably will not last for a very long time). The valuation is to tempting for me. With a PE of 10 I cant believe that you can have a permanent loss on this company. ROE unbelievable high, the growth in the foreign countries is very stable.

Why Gannett?

This is not a ROE-play and I do not think that Gannett will have a better position in the future than it has now.

So why Gannett? PE=7, PB=0.7 . The ROE will sink even further but with this low price I am still convinced that the probability of a permanent loss is low.

But Gannett is definetely not a longterm play. But I think the reward will be satisfying.

Happy investing Jan Hendrik!


Hi Karin,thanks for your

Hi Karin,

thanks for your fast and in-depth answer. Gannett will run into problems in the future since most of their cost basis is fixed. I do not think that the online business is going to replace all of the declining newspaper sales and hence we will see intensifying earnings pressure. I would not rely on the 7 PE since we talk about top-of-the-cycle ad sales. Ad volume might be much lower in recession times.

HOG is an amazing company and I have been successfully trading around the stock for the last couple of years. I am seeing some volume trouble on the horizon though since there might be a celing of worldwide sales for these kind of motorcycles. The market just won't grow at 10% each year forever, especially since the baby-boomer sales push might be running out. Also some discretionary spending issues on that one.

I appreciate your comments on JNJ- it's such a well managed company and a pretty darn good investor from Omaha likes them as well. I am with you on the low PE/ high ROE but keep one aspect in mind please: how much capital will they be able to put to work in the future?
It's not that they can reinvest all their FCFs at 29%...I wish they could but this is not how things work :)

- Jan

P.S.: Good to hear you are still long Bijou :)



Hi JanHendrik,I always enjoy my conversations with you

Hi JanHendrik,

to your last post:

1. JNJ

I am always a skeptical person. I asked me a lot of times why JNJ should deliver such good results in the future. My answer: They are in 3 business. And all of their business have an unbelievable moat that is in the near and longer future hard to destroy.
I dont expect that they can invest their FCFs at 29% in the future. But I am relatively sure that I dont see a dip under 20% in the next ten to twenty years. By the way I could think that the people thought some 20 years ago, that JNJ could not handle its high ROE. Now we think the same.......

2. HOG

In my view to good to pass like I stated. Even if I value the company with a 2-5% growth rate I find it unbelievable cheap. And the best: Everybody hates the company. I havent seen an article where the author havent stated that when the babyboomers are gone nobody will buy a HOG bike. I dont believe in this view.

3. GCI

I put the PE to show how cheap the company is. But I definetely think that the earnings peaked and will decline. But with the low PB I feel very safe.

But this is more a "Graham-style"pick than a "WEB-style"pick.
The dividend will probably compensate a lot for the cloudy outlook. In the last 6 years the dividend almost tripled. And with the satisfying Cashflow I have no fear that the dividend will rise in a satisfying way.

Happy investing!

I am looking forward to your writing on the analyst conference for Bijou!

Hi Karin,thanks for your

Hi Karin,

thanks for your answer. HOG is too risky for my taste and GCI seems to have structural problems embedded. Let's see how things go :)

Concerning JNJ and NOK: I am not sure that future growth is enough to justify the current stock prices. Still looking at both of them though- will keep you updated.

- Jan

P.S.: By the way: where do you live in Germany?

Hi JanHendrik,

I live in the south of the country near Karlsruhe.

nokia- some thoughts

Hi Karin,

let's share thoughts on NOK:

- very conservatively financed, very overcapitalized indeed

- use cash to increase dividend/ repurchase shares--> great!

- amazing ROCE: only need a couple billion net WC and two billion PP&E to generate €7.5 Bln EBIT

- NokiaSiemens just break-even, most costs one-time only, €2.00 Bln cost savings announced

- excl. one-time gains and the NokiaSiemens operating loss, 2007 FCF (including growth capex) come in at approx. €5.80 Bln (already accounting for NVT)

- EV (also including the $8.1 Bln for NVT) is approx. €66 Bln on 4/26

- assuming €6 Bln trailing FCF, EV/FCF=11

- valuation is absolutely fine (as you pointed out earlier)

growth is the issue:

- they only project 10% volume growth for the overall devices market

- will market share gains come to an end?!

- what about ASPs?!

- what effect is GPS going to have?

- what is the mid-term profitabilty of NokiaSiemens?

I recognize though that we do not need much growth to justify NOK's valuation.


Karin, please let me know your thoughts about Nokia's growth story :) :) :)

- jan

Like you stated- valuation is absolutely fine

Hi JanHendrik,

like you stated: the valuation is absolutely fine, the earnings in the last 15 years looked very reliable, the moat is in my view still intact.

Under these circumstances with an actual PE of 10 I dont need to see a "big growth opportunity".

But to your questions:
A-Wow. 10% volume growth for the overall mobile phone market? I would be glad to see it.

=> I dont mind how high the growth rate will be (I would err all the time). What I do know:
1. Low actual valuation

2. Very high probability that the revenues and earnings will grow (how high this growth will be? I have no clue.)

B- Will market share gains come to an end?
I absolutely dont know but it dont cares me either. I would have no problem if the market share would decline if the overall growth would overcompensate it.
But like I stated in the first post:

1. Nokia benefits from the economics of scale
2. There is a good chance that GPS could be a satisfying (Revenue and earnings) application. I am not for myself interested in electronic devices (I am probably one of the dumbest persons when it comes to handle computers and telephones or mobile phones). But what I do know is: If GPS is integrated in the mobile phone I will definetely throw my old mobile phone away. I dont think I am the only person that thinks so.
3. There is a chance that Nokia could compete with the Tomtoms and Garmins in the world.

So a low valuation and a moat coupled with a good chance that in the near future could come a earnings boost seems to me like a good bet. If there is a chance to take market shares from other business it is even a reason more to sleep well at night.

C- What about the ASPs?
What the hell is a ASP?

D- What effect is GPS going to have

Like I said in b)

I see a good chance (the probalitiy is definetely not 100%) that GPS will drive the growth in the European countries and Northamerica.

Computergeeks are maybe not interested in this application, but boneheads like me or the typicall Hans Schmitt aka Joe Sixpack are definetely interested in such an application. So I would guess that there will be an additional growth opportunity (additional because I think that the growth in countries such as China, Russia and India has not ended. It seems to me that it just started.

E- Mid-term profitability of NokiaSiemens

I have not broken my head about it. There is only one thing that I am almost absolute sure:

The earnings will not be lower (ok, ok I know what you want to say: What earnings have NokiaSiemens made) in the future. Why do I think so:

1. Nokia is very cost-conscious. Even in good times they take absolutely rude paths to take care of the business (Ask the workers of Nokia Bochum. I am thinking that they will support my thesis ;-))

2. Take my word not 100% granted on the following because I have not a specified source except my memory:

I am pretty sure that I have read on the Handelsblatt during the time of the NokiaSiemens-merger that there have been some kind of side agreements in the workings to the initial deal. Why the side agreement: Because Siemens was under pressure because of the Bhagshish-scandal. During these rough times for Siemens, Nokia pressed them the pistole to the head and said if there are no new agreements they would let burst the initial deal.

I would not be very impressed if the earnings would be divided fairly and Siemens takes a big share of the risk.

Summary: With the low valuation (and the valuation is in my view very, very low) I need not a lot of growth to feel sure that Nokia is a favourable bet for me. But how high the growth will be? I dont know. I havent even thought about it. (And if I would have an estimate it would probably a big error in it)
I feel definetely sure to predict (but I am not good in predicting) that the growth will be satisfying.

Happy investing

Karin,NOK is now in

Karin,

NOK is now in stokblogs, personal and client's accounts- and I am feeling comfortable with it!

Let's see whether we got this one right :)


Thanks again for pointing it out to me,


-Jan